# Designing Great Software User Experiences

> A NachoTuesday interview — the C-Suite Insights series from NachoNacho, the B2B SaaS and AI
> marketplace. In conversation with Kanad Bahalkar, Founder, Potion.

- **Page:** https://nachonacho.com/nachotuesday/video/Designing-Great-Software-User-Experiences
- **Guest:** Kanad Bahalkar, Founder, Potion
- **Guest on LinkedIn:** https://www.linkedin.com/in/kanadbahalkar/
- **Recorded:** 2024-01-11
- **Watch:** https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=noZoVWgJKgM

## Summary

In this NachoTuesday, Andy Karuza interviews Kanad Bahalkar, Founder at Potion. In this interview, they covered how to design a proper MVP (Minimal Viable Product). They also covered tips for building a product with a great user experience and how to enable Product-led Growth.

## Product discussed

- **Name:** Potion
- **Page:** https://nachonacho.com/product/potion
- **What it is:** AI video outreach software that allows users to reach out to potential customers or partners through video messaging.
- **NachoNacho deal:** 25% CASHBACK All Plans. Forever.
- **Estimated savings:** Save up to $1,491/year

## Full transcript

Good afternoon, everyone, and welcome to another NachoTuesday. Today, I have Kanad here with Potion, and without further ado, Kanad, if you could, we'd love to learn a little bit more about what Potion does in a quick elevator pitch. Kanad: Sure thing! First of all, thank you so much for having me on NachoTuesday. I know it's a super fun program, and I've been following Naaj for quite some time now. I had the pleasure of meeting Sanai a long time ago; I don't think he even remembers me. So, thank you for having me on. I’m Kanad, founder and CEO of Potion. Potion is a generative video AI platform, which is a fancy way of saying that our AI allows folks to create, update, edit, and generate videos using only text input. Our first application is for sales teams selling B2B products to their prospects. We help them personalize videos at scale. Interviewer: Very cool! What got you down this path in your career? What drew you to AI, aside from it being the hottest buzzword around these days? Kanad: I think the AI bug, if you will, was sparked by Evan Shapiro and David Jensen, who were the founders of M Health. I give them credit for that. Before starting Potion, I worked at Google, and before Google, I was at a small startup in San Francisco called Nit Health. They built a camera that could detect sleeping and breathing disorders in kids, such as sleep apnea. It was a very rewarding project, and I got to see firsthand how the team implemented AI solutions in hardware to solve problems that were almost impossible to tackle otherwise. I became completely obsessed after that. The idea for Potion germinated from my fascination with AI and the customer experience. I realized that sending personalized videos significantly increased engagement, but scaling this approach was challenging. So, we decided to apply our AI learnings to build Potion. Interviewer: Definitely interesting. I’d like to learn more about how Potion works. Can you explain to our audience how the platform actually operates? Kanad: Absolutely. As a user, you record a video using your front camera, just like this one. Once you record the video, you select parts of it that you want to personalize—things like the greeting, the company name, or the background of the video. Potion then automatically personalizes that video template for thousands of recipients. It’s super easy to use. Interviewer: That’s really interesting. So, for instance, I could change the intro line to say, "Hey Kanad," and then send a video to my CEO saying, "Hey Sanjay." It would still be me on camera, but it could also include a voiceover, correct? Kanad: Exactly. We handle the voiceover and accurate lip-syncing as well. Typically, a use case might be someone recording a video like, "Hey there, this is John sending a video from my company," with a sales pitch. Potion then changes that "Hey there" to "Hey Andy," "Hey John," "Hey Jenny," without creating entire new videos from scratch. We also customize the video’s domain and picture-in-picture mode to match the recipient’s background. Interviewer: And why is personalization so important today? As the world moves more towards automation, it seems like focusing on personalization in marketing is still crucial. Why do you think that is? Kanad: It’s strange, but the sweetest words to anyone’s ears are their name. Coupling that with visuals, like their own LinkedIn profile or website, is incredibly attention-grabbing. We live in the economy of attention now, so anything that captures and holds attention is crucial. Personalization helps achieve that. It’s important to convey your message effectively because everyone is sending cold emails that are just copy-paste templates. Personalization helps cut through the noise, making sure your message gets heard. It also makes the recipient feel that the sender has gone above and beyond to create a personalized message, making them more willing to invest time in it. Interviewer: That’s a great point. With so many tools available, it’s easier to get someone's contact information and show up in their inbox. This results in people learning how to block out irrelevant messages. So, video and personalization become really powerful. What other tips would you offer for creating engaging videos that grab attention and actually convert? Kanad: It’s funny you mention that; we’ve been discussing this with my team. I’m putting together a guide with all the tips, tricks, and tools we’ve learned. So far, Potion has generated over four million videos for our users. We’ve identified some patterns on what works well. Here are the top three tips: Include the prospect’s name in the video intro: Starting your video with “Hey Andy” is way more engaging than “Hi, I’m Kanad.” Make sure to open with the sweetest sound, which is the prospect’s name. Personalize the background: Incorporate the prospect’s website or LinkedIn profile as a picture-in-picture mode. Like Loom videos with a bubble in the corner, if the background is also personalized for the recipient, they are more likely to engage with your message. Add clear CTA buttons: When crafting your video landing page, include CTA buttons or widgets like Calendly to provide a clear call-to-action. Interviewer: Great advice. And what about timing? With people starved for attention these days, what’s the ideal length for a video, especially for sales outreach? Kanad: It’s subjective. If you’re sending an initial opener, keep the video short—30 seconds or less. However, as you progress further down the sales cycle, it’s okay to send longer videos, especially if the prospect is interested in experiencing your product. Sometimes, full-blown demos can be longer. There are also videos that explain your product’s value without a demo, such as case study or presentation walkthroughs, which can be one to one-and-a-half minutes long. But for cold outreach, keep the video as short as possible—30 to 45 seconds. Interviewer: That’s a great point. You have a lot of experience with product design. What tips would you offer for startups that want to follow a similar path in developing an MVP product and getting that crucial product launch? So, it's a really important question but also very difficult. I need to think about this for a second. From a design perspective, one of the biggest mistakes I've seen among my friends and other founder acquaintances is not treating design as a function of the product. What do I mean by that? Often, especially engineers, start building things without properly engineering the product. Having a proper UX guideline with appropriate nomenclature, well-organized design boards on tools like Figma, and collaborating with your engineering team on different states of the UI is crucial. If these aspects are not done properly, it’s not a good sign. That’s one of the biggest issues when it comes to design management for MVPs. Once you finish your design, take it to your friends and ask them to click through the prototype. Observe where they aren’t clicking where you want them to, and see if their experience is guided or unguided. You may realize that some features you thought were critical for the MVP aren’t necessary. This allows you to remove them and focus on the absolute essence of one or two features for your MVP. One common mistake with MVPs is thinking that it needs to be of poor quality. That’s not true. Minimal viable doesn’t mean poor quality. It needs to be as small as possible in terms of requirements but also high in quality. This means writing test cases and defining all the flows and logic in your designs. That’s another big thing that I’ve noticed people don’t handle well when it comes to MVPs. Overbuilding and Learning from Experience A lot of times, people overbuild, thinking that if they build it, people will come. I’ve definitely been guilty of that myself. Some of the products we built were extremely over-engineered. We didn’t always consider the pull from the market either. Understanding what customers want and building it in the most effective way is crucial. It’s something you learn by doing. You don’t just read about it in a book and master it right away. You can read books like The Lean Startup by Eric Ries and Hooked by Nir Eyal, which are valuable resources. I need to reread them myself. I have a few favorite books that I revisit every now and then to refresh my knowledge. Even if you’ve read something before, revisiting it can provide new insights, much like watching The Godfather or Seinfeld at different points in your life—your perspective changes, and you see things differently. Product-Led Growth What are your thoughts on Product-Led Growth (PLG)? I’m a big fan of PLG. I believe it’s one of the key marketing strategies today. Anything that can create a free growth flywheel built into the product is valuable. What tips do you have for that? A great question. To be fully honest, we are actively not trying to build PLG at Potion. Since we work with sales teams, we want the product to speak to their needs, so we’re intentionally not focusing on building PLG loops right now. However, I believe PLG will be important for us in the future. One case study that intrigued me recently is Notion. Notion achieved PLG somewhat accidentally. The company was struggling, and the founders moved to Kyoto, Japan, to rebuild it. They started with a website builder and then developed a documentation tool. Some influencers picked it up because it was well-designed and started creating and sharing templates with their community. Since you can create templates for various life aspects—travel plans, meal plans, organization types—people began using these templates and had to sign up for Notion to access them. This created a self-fulfilling loop: the more content was created, the more people signed up and shared the tool. Another good example is Loom. When you share a Loom video with someone, they see the link and think, “Cool, I can do this too,” so they sign up. For anyone thinking about implementing PLG, it’s essential to connect content with the product. Consider what users can create with your product, how that content gets shared, and how you facilitate sharing the content or the tool itself. This connection between PLG, content, and product is crucial. Product and Content Value It’s crucial to ensure that the product provides value first. For content-driven products, hiding content behind a paywall or sign-up wall can deter users from engaging with your product initially. It’s important to offer value through content or other means that encourage exploration of your application rather than prompting users to give their email right away. The person sharing the content must also benefit from it. A common mistake is the use of generic "invite your friends" tools that often fail to resonate. LinkedIn used this strategy aggressively in its early days, automatically sending invitations to everyone in a user's email contact list. This tactic worked because LinkedIn was among the first to do it. However, such methods are less effective today. People are now more resistant to unsolicited invitations and aggressive marketing tactics. Moreover, LinkedIn’s approach, while effective at the time, isn’t a true example of Product-Led Growth (PLG). PLG involves users actively engaging with the product itself to drive growth, not just receiving external invitations. For instance, Notion achieved PLG almost by accident. The company started with a basic tool but gained traction when influencers began creating and sharing templates. This led to more users signing up to access and share these templates, creating a growth loop inherent in the product’s use. Tips for Startups For startups, especially those in the early stages, joining a community like On Deck Fellowship can be incredibly beneficial. This program is selective but offers a network of early-stage founders who collaborate, explore ideas, and keep each other accountable. If you’re at the idea stage and don’t yet have a product, this can provide invaluable support. If you are building an MVP or the first iteration of your product, the best advice is to launch it as soon as possible. Platforms like Reddit, Hacker News, or Product Hunt are great for this. You will likely face criticism and rejection, but it’s important to launch anyway. You can’t perfect your product in isolation; you need feedback to improve it. Embrace the negative comments and use them to refine your offering. It’s important to understand that achieving product-market fit takes time—years, in fact. The hustle culture is real, and building a successful product is a long-term commitment. It’s like going to the gym; you don’t get fit overnight. The same applies to developing a product that resonates with the market. The so-called “overnight success” is often a result of many years of hard work. The Reality of Success Take ChatGPT as an example. OpenAI had been developing products for years before launching ChatGPT. Although ChatGPT itself is relatively new, it was built upon extensive prior research and iterations. This demonstrates that there’s no such thing as an overnight success. Success often comes after years of groundwork and persistence. Timing, public relations, and the actual launch strategy play crucial roles. Launching into entrepreneurial communities for early feedback is essential. Once you have product-market fit, you can focus on broader marketing strategies, like press releases or launch events. However, avoid spending too much on promotional materials like business cards and t-shirts before ensuring your product works and attracts customers. I’ve experienced the excitement of a first startup and the realization that sometimes the product isn’t ready for the hype. Swag and Milestones We haven't created or shared any swag, like t-shirts or hats, for Potion at all. We're saving that for a really significant moment, such as when we raise our next round of funding next year. At that point, I'll be able to say, "Look, we worked for three to four years as hard as we could, and here’s a t-shirt to commemorate that achievement," rather than using swag merely as a marketing tool. It's more about reminding ourselves of the progress we've made and grounding ourselves, rather than celebrating prematurely. Causes of Startup Failure Based on my experience, most startups fail due to a lack of appropriate listening skills and perseverance. Not listening to customers—understanding their needs and feedback—is a major reason for failure. While VCs might point to founder disputes as a common cause of failure, I believe persistence and continuous improvement are crucial. If you keep pushing and adapting based on user feedback, eventually, you will find something that resonates with your audience. Persistence through tough times is key. Vision and Empathy In the early stages, having a clear vision is vital. It’s about knowing where you want to go and taking one step at a time to reach that vision. Empathy with customer needs is crucial; building something based on your assumptions rather than actual user feedback is a common pitfall. Many startups begin with an engineering mindset, thinking they can fix a problem in a specific way, only to find out they were wrong. Listening to customers and adapting is essential to prevent failure. Future Plans for Potion Looking ahead, Potion is working on a platform for generative video and audio content. Think of it like ChatGPT, but for videos. We’re starting with a specific use case for sales, but the AI can be applied to various other areas. For example, it could be used to translate English videos into other languages, create personalized video ads, or tailor educational content for individual learners. We plan to build tooling that allows users to create their own applications and businesses on top of our AI. Ethics and AI Another critical focus for us is ensuring that the content produced through our platform is ethical. We’re concerned about misuse, such as creating malicious content or misinformation. For instance, there was an issue earlier this year where an AI face was used to spread disinformation. We want to prevent such misuse while making sure that creating ethical content remains as straightforward as possible. Identity and Authenticity An important aspect of our approach is preventing the upload of videos featuring other people’s faces or voices to create misleading content. Our platform only allows users to record themselves using their webcams, which helps maintain authenticity and prevents misuse. We enforce this policy strictly and have even turned down business from customers who did not adhere to these guidelines. Conclusion I appreciate your support and the opportunity to discuss these issues. If anyone from the NachoNacho community is interested, Potion is featured in the NachoNacho Marketplace with a 25% lifetime discount. Check us out for personalized video solutions that can improve conversions. Thank you, Kanad, for joining the conversation today. It was a pleasure discussing these topics with you.

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